December 16, 2012 at 11:07 am #257484AnonymousGuest
as those i ahve known for a very long time now would no doubt realise, i have nothing to sell, i have no barrow that i am pushing in support of green followings, no one entity has all the answers but they way they work and manipulate thinking, sense is out the door along with common sense now called uncommon sense.
now due to health issues i have had for a decade or more i have had to build higher gardens, no choice or no gardens at all, there is no ready materials on or near site to use as fence posts or garden edging.
1st thing we needed a fence to keep other peoples cows, horses and dogs from our property, and also so our dogs could free range our 1 + acre block. that means our animals are not going to cause any other person grief.
2nd len buys 7X6 meter sheets of fresh brand new corro’ zinc’ fresh from china, in that action due to teh current climes i did not support employment in teh steel manufacturing industry, the roofing was most likely made from aussie iron ore trained a long distance to teh coast and loaded onto ships for a very long trip to china for one, manufactured (without a corbon tax thingy) and shipped back here where it is screwed to rooves of houses and sheds etc.,.
so little len buys 6 sheets would make no difference whatsoever to this eco’ environ’ thing people seem to be all fuzzy about, teh maker would not step up production hamersly or who ever would not have stepped up production. and if it was all mined for and used in australia creating wealth for the country and employment so what, that would be a good result surely or what would we use for building, bridges, skyscrapers homes and shed. timber from plantation timber that has been grown where healthy habitat once stood?
3rd i did try to source second hand roofing from demo’ or reno’ jobs, but teh scrap yard just couldn’t get teh message so any good stuff teh got they drove over and crumpled up to send it south in huge trucks (not eco’ friendly) plying our highways gathering all sort of scrap metal.
i did call in lots of times, they took my name and promised to call once they had some i said we would come as quick as and say yay or nay, but no call ever came, so we sued expensive seemingly poor quallity chinese stuff(we are plastic millionaires like some), so low and behold we jsut happen along to teh scrap yard and there was all this good tin, we paid and emplored he not damge it, he deliverd it on semi trailer for $25 he charged us .50c a kilo the going rate for scrap steel.
but alas we had to buy more new start paickets probably from china, wonder will our recent purchase of star pickets drive up steel demand, couldn’t afford the galv’ models. oh! and will be buying more pickets and wire and hopefully SH corro to build a chook run to protect them from foxes the pom’s bought in at settlement(prob’ ahve to pay delivery again).
all i can say to everyone is take care, in this new world.
hope this clears teh air on what and why we are now doing things, we buy what we can afford or go without.
lenDecember 16, 2012 at 1:21 pm #529674casalentaMember
Len, I went to one of our local ‘Cheap as Chips’ shops recently looking for something that wasn’t made in China. The only thing I found was an unpainted wooden placemat.
Who said slavery was dead? It isn’t dead at all – we just let the slaves stay home (in China) instead of shipping them somewhere else. But what happens when they refuse to work for slave wages and all the prices go up? We have already forgotten how to manufacture almost everything for ourselves.
Good luck with your property. Buy what you can afford or go without is my motto too.December 16, 2012 at 3:58 pm #529675AnonymousGuest
thank you casalenta,
the thing that is inverted in the middle calss high end user mind is they buy stuff that does not support aussie families, well mainly there now is none, they buy those certain sports joggers and swish clothes labelled all made by slaves doing 12 hour shifts and 6 day weeks, for a pittance of no more than $2 or less and hour, crammed into a bunk house dormitory between shfits barely able to afford time or money to go visit their country families they work to support.
all my tank tops and shorts and things and jocks come from china, i replace them when they fall apart, i know i support a network of middle people making huge profits out of those sweat slave shops.
take care please bad things coming our way i feel.
just now on ABC more middle class waste reno’uing and old manor when poor suffer, big ego trip for those involved.
lenDecember 16, 2012 at 5:22 pm #529676GKindredMember
If you have soil under foot, you have all the material you need to make fences/raised garden beds.
It’s called Compressed Earth Block/Bricks.
Simply made using a manual machine or automatic (depending on budget) press that will give you around 100 bricks per hour.
Or failing that, grab some recycled pallets, make a box frame and max some mud/adobe bricks.
Will take some time to get what you are after, but you’ll have what you need.
Gumtree.com.au also lists free stuff, so check your area and see if you can recycle anything that is on offer.December 16, 2012 at 11:31 pm #529677AnonymousGuest
sounds like rubbish. no spare soil here and i don’t see the benefit in ruining even more habitat to feel green.
maybe your money tree produces better, we can’t even afford to get soil moved for growing areas please get real.
you are not experienced with what we have and where we are, for me right now i can’t even drive star pickets into the ground.
we did save a lot by raking trailer after trailer load of slashed grass from paddocks.
like i said you have no idea what we are going through.
lenDecember 16, 2012 at 11:57 pm #529678AndreKeymaster
I’m sure things are difficult for you len…
Geoff Lawton, a permaculture expert, cultivated 10 acres of land adjacent to the Dead Sea.
By using swales and mulching, he rehabilitated the very salty soil so as to be able to grow local foods. So in essence, if you have soil (and rain and mulch) then an almost salt-pan be fixed to grow stuff.
Mind you, from what you say, I dare say the ground is far too hard? – hence the raised beds I guess.
And now with my moderator hat on – if you have a reply to your dilemma – you could ignore the other party or be polite and thank them. Telling them their advice is rubbish is just rude.
All that was suggested, instead of buying in sheet metal, perhaps an adobe wall would be another option to consider. In fact, making a simple frame out of wood and then making your own mud bricks would be dirt cheap – pardon the pun. .. although it would be hard work initially.December 17, 2012 at 12:05 am #529679JarnMember
Wow I was going to add some ideas but read the last reply by Len, Hmmm I think maybe I’m in the same boat as others and do not know what you are going through, sorry to hear it sounds like your doing it tough. Anyway regardless of experience for an area or someones situation this is a forum after all, and I’m sure every post has its merits and is valued input. Hope it all gets a bit easier for you.December 17, 2012 at 12:13 am #529680lavmanMember
It sounds like you are going through a rough patch, there are plenty of knockers around, keep doing what you’re doing and keep your garden growing, thats more important than where you got the material to build the beds :tup: if you were a woman I’d give you one of those hug icons but I will leave that for the female ALSers
Cheers mate, keep your head up
KevDecember 17, 2012 at 8:46 am #529681AnonymousGuest
there are no other options for our garden bed besides the horse has bolted on ideas of any sort the well thought out and the ehart string pullers, i don’t often call a spade a spade but i was not looking for ideas i was simply stating what we have done, to stop the pc critics.
we wanted second hand tin from the start, dealing with the scrap metal bloke was not easy as he could not imagine why anyone would want second hand tin, all he wanted to do was drive out around rural (long distances) and collect the stuff then pile it on one of those big scrap metal dump trucks that ply our highway to take this stuff to a recycler probably smelter somewhere.
now we can’t buy second hand star pickets, or the bit of new wire we use to lash it all together.
now using any sort of blocks compacted earth clay or cement cannot be anymore green in feeling as all blocks would need a foundation to be built on or it would all fall over. plus anyone who does it might find they dig huge holes around their property damaging teh soil habitat. i don’t see compacted earth as being anymore eco’ friendly than any new material.
we think things out first, we sue lots of sense and common sense not driven by other doctrines, this time bales would not do, back and body getting too old, we highly recommend higher beds but the edging can’t add to the width of the growing area suggest 1 meter.
we need more tin for our chook house i’m sure compated earth sitting on top of star pickets would not suffice, certainly push the price of the project skyward, to the sun god.
lavman, all could use a heart felt hug at times.
all we need now is a good fall of rain to water the beds properly and all systems will be go! all we do presently is spot water in dry beds. if the dry continues may ahve to divert pennies to bringing in second hand water for the gardens at least, can’t do much with individual plants about teh place, they just go dry. and yes everything is well mulched.
would love to be able to afford some rip swaling, but best we may get is some berms created from loose soil, no guarantees.
lenDecember 17, 2012 at 9:55 am #529682lostinthefogMember
That was a cheery thread to start the day….reminds me of that poem, “We’ll all be doomed, said Hanrahan” :laugh:, seriously tho’ it is awfully frustrating at times & sometimes there is no alternative but the ‘non green’ item…we can only do our best as individuals.
Len…it is possible to buy some clothes NOT made in China…usually higher end clothes but still affordable if you buy secondhand…I buy nearly all my clothes secondhand, same with shoes, there are some very good shoe manufacturers that produce shoes without sweatshop labour and use sustainable products…El Naturalista & Trippen spring to mind but there are others. Are they cheap? No!!! BUT they last forever and it is possible to buy secondhand….
I have to disagree with you Len regarding the manor house being restored on the ABC TV program….it’s not middle class elitism…that manor is a beautiful thing and the world is sorely in need of beautiful things…it’s like saying ornamental gardens are a waste of resources…sometimes we just need some beauty in our lives!
The other thought I had Len…is it not possible for you to move? Maybe finding somewhere that isn’t such hard work would be the answer…I’ve battled with recalcitrant soil in my time and it can be heartbreaking…not to say backbreaking…December 17, 2012 at 10:43 am #529683HummerKeymaster
gardenlen post=351564 wrote:
now those who have these feel goods what roof do they live under, what fencing do they have etc.,. etc.,.
why someone felt they had the right to criticise our gardens on a topic about nitrogen drawdown i don’t know but at the very least their post was of topic.
wonder do the critics actually achieve anything along these lines.
they don’t come with their own web sites to show and help others with and no charge.
Len what sort of comments are these ?
What is a ‘feel good’ ? Do you mean a fellow member ?
Unless I have missed something, no-one was criticising you, only trying to offer you alternatives.December 17, 2012 at 11:09 am #529684AnonymousGuest
humbug i think you have been around long enough to see that lots of so called green feel is simple feel good stuff, being seen to do something.
and that manor house is so wrong in a world where people starve and have no proper shelter or even basic services like safe water and some power. it is a yuppy feel good project where the wealthy can exploit their ego’s for no benefit to mankind, the manor is a monument to wastefull times. those people may not be a pretty site but they are humans.
the gardens are built criticism or other ideas probably far from relevent, at the moment with the difficulties of heat and humitiy caused by habitat degredation we are gathering the last of our lumpy material (bark) for the last garden before filling it.
we’ve got 88 humidity and 26 temp.
oh! yeh! waht roof do the critics live under?
sorry also as many times as we have looked in opportunity shops they don’t sell stuff for larger blokes.
lenDecember 17, 2012 at 11:37 am #529685HummerKeymaster
You sound very bitter & negative .. & I seriously doubt that any help/suggestions offered your way will be sufficient for you.
When striving to live the simpler life, everyone comes up against hurdles..
Don’t you think it is nice when people/members even bother to notice that you are struggling.. & show their support by commenting ? Even if the solution they’re offering isn’t suitable ?
There is a more friendlier way of saying Thanks but No Thanks.
oh! yeh! waht roof do the critics live under?
I wouldn’t answer any of your putdown questions.. don’t be surprised if others don’t either. Negativity breeds negativity .. a little optimism goes a long way 🙂December 17, 2012 at 12:18 pm #529686TropicalRoseParticipant
I find it hard too Len on a small income. Its often more expensive to be ‘green’ especially if you can’t make it to a dump shop or have osteoporosis like I have or other health probs that stop you from making bricks or digging much and no one to help. Good luck with your new projects and good on you for trying to be as green as you can.December 17, 2012 at 12:54 pm #529687AnonymousGuest
no humbug don’t label me and also don’t blame me for others who criticise so yet no one has any idea how or where they live. if nothing else i’m somewhat public on my web page.
i don’t aim to be seen as doing something by looking diffrent i get out there and work with what i have.
i think i don’t hide behind the anonimity of the web.
and sorry i am not bitter as you judge me, not happy with the way others either run the world or changes they only want.
find your post fit into critical with lack of knowledge and wisdom. the negative judgement too is from other merits.
to visit dump shops or scrap yard entails taking trailer as we only have a sedan, then nowhere for us to park trailer while we shop, our economy is no more than one trip to town per week. and then teh effort might all be for nought.
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